The title of this post is lie number one of a litany of lies to be found on the Internet.
You are NOT going to learn how to rewire a vintage phone. You are not.
I know this from experience. But I'm getting a bit ahead of myself as I am want to do when I'm in fits.
I have a number of oddities hidden in my basement. For instance there's this. And these.
Amongst the stuff is a collection of antique/vintage telephones. Some work. Some don't. You may wonder why I care whether or not a relic of a phone with an actual dial on it works or not. I like them. I like old phones. I like old things. And I particularly like old thing that can still be used. There's a certain nostalgia and sentimentality about using a big old handset. Plus if you're on it you can tell people you can't talk any longer 'cause you're stuck to the wall and you need to get things done. That excuse doesn't work if you're talking on a portable phone.
There's one in particular I've been wanting to get up and running for a long time.
This phone was in my grandmother's house in Renfrew, Ontario. It's not only in perfect condition, it's one of a couple of phones in my basement that have been part of my family for generations.
So some time before Christmas I decided to look up how to rewire some of my old phones with their vintage 3 wires ...
... to a modern phone line. One would think it's just a matter of attaching red to red, green to green and so on. But it's not. Sometimes this connection will get the phone to work to make and receive calls, but the ringer won't work. Or it'll make calls but can't receive them. Or vice versa. It's a messy business this phone wiring thing. They're like Fiats. Or Lindsay Lohan's brain. Nobody really knows how the wiring works.
I looked up a few tutorials on-line and a few videos on YouTube and one video seemed to have great potential. All you have to do is attach red to red, combine the green and yellow from the phone and attach them to the green of the phone jack line.
I'm not sure why I was shocked when it didn't work but it was the Opening a Wine bottle with a Tree Trunk all over again.
Around 3 hours into it I realized, this probably wasn't gonna work out for you folks. I would NOT be doing a post on how to make your vintage telephone ring.
But I wasn't giving up on mine. You see, I have that gene in me. That little slice of DNA that won't allow me to stop. I can't give up. I will get so angry and frustrated at points that I need to eat potato chips just to calm down.
Because of the Great and Stupid Paleo experiment, we don't have any potato chips.
So I got more angry and more frustrated and decided to work through it by eating a block of cheese. Which isn't very good alone in large portions so I also had some crackers. I'm O.K. with that.
You know why? That little respite from the stupid Paleo plan was enough to get me to settle down and figure it out.
I had another old wall phone downstairs that was wired properly so I dragged that upstairs and compared the guts. They were similar. Similar enough that I could figure out how to hard wire the new phone jack line into the old phone. It made calls and received them. No ring.
So I made some uneducated guesses moving wires and changing things and finally ... it rang.
The phone now holds court in the living room.
If I'd had a bag of potato chips around instead of just cheese and crackers I'm fairly certain I would have been able to resolve any and all conflicts in the Middle East.
And because you were kind of screwed out of any learning anything at all in this post, I have made for you this little video proving that my phone does indeed ring and work.
Vintage Phone ring
Proof of vintage phone working.
Yet another reason to love the olden day phones. No Skype.
Greg Field
It was, and still is, very common for one manufacturer to buy the product of another and simply rebrand it with their own brand with full permission of the seller. GM was the first developer of the automatic "Hydromatic" transmission, which Ford bought from GM and branded it the "Fordomatic". From 1988 to 2000 GM sold the GEO Metro which was actually the Suzuki Sprint made under license from Suzuki at their plant in Canada. What you have is the Northern Electric branded Western Electric manufactured 302. It has a Northern Electric dial, which I see having looked more closely at your photo, everything else came from Western Electric. It would have been more expensive that it was worth to try to duplicate all of the inner workings down to the last detail when they could buy most of this ready made at wholesale prices directly from Western Electric. Nobody wants to spend money on tooling up to try to duplicate something when they can actually buy the real deal directly from the manufacturer at affordable wholesale prices, turn it over for a profit without having to recoup a tooling investment. Suzuki set up the car plant in Canada for GM to operate providing all of the tools and expertise. It gets confusing about these phones, but this is incontrovertible. So we're both right in a sense, but Northern electric actually only made the dial on yours, they ordered the handset to be imprinted with their brand, and if you look for a wiring diagram for a Northern Electric 302 here http://www.telephonecollectors.info/index.php/browse/wiring-diagrams/doc_details/2001-300-style-desk-phones-ne-302-ne302-tl you will get a generic diagram for all 302s from both manufacturers, and in that diagram it even refers to a type 5 dial, which is Western Electric, and it also shows the 101A coil network, which as I said is absolutely and entirely of Western Electric manufacture. If I hadn't seen the inside of yours I would not have been entirely sure, but I know these parts like the back of my hand, and am familiar with the practices of manufacturers buying parts or entire products from other manufacturers
greg field
I have restored many dozens of 302s, I have about 6 in the assembly line as we speak. Any other phone manufacturer would be prohibited by law from duplicating another's phone and using the same model number. What you are referring to is probably the telephone service provider from that time period. Most of them refer the the "Bell" telephone system. I know the guts and parts for these inside out, and there is NO doubt that this is a western electric 302 with bakelite F1 handset. You can see F1 written on the handset. The network coil says 101A and is dated 1/18/47. or maybe 1/16/47. The zinc case means it was likely made in the early 40s, you can probably see a date in orange ink on the inside of the base near the bottom. These did not hit the market until 1937, but most of them were made after 1940. By the end of WW2 they has been changed to plastic bodies to save metal for war manufacturing. The 101A network is solely the product of Western Electric. If you look at the inside of the dial it is probably a 5H dial, maybe a later 6A if the gears are in a plastic housing, the dial is marked Western Electric which you can see stamped into it if you remove it. You can adjust bell volume by moving the end of the spring from one indent to the 2nd or third position, or you can stuff pieces of cloth against the gongs
Karen
I see you really are well informed. But it really is true. "Northern Electric almost mirrored the WE product line including telephone sets, 1317, 202, 302, 500's to name a few and the unusual "Uniphone" that looked like a 302 turned sideways. It is my understanding that this set was never used by Bell Canada but by the subsidiary holdings such as New Brunswick Tel and Maritime Tel ant Tel. Thus the Canadian and US sets differ only by the label in some cases." ~ karen
Greg Field
What you have is a western electric 302, not northern electric. I've been restoring phones for a long time, and you can make ANY phone work, some will only be extensions, but any phone with a dial can be adapted, and it's usually fairly simple if you have some experience with wiring, electricity, and tools. If you are a novice it's not that hard to learn basics. If there is nothing wrong with the phone it is very easy to adapt to modular, you can do it using the existing line cord if you have it or using a readily available phone wire available from electronics suppliers. Using the original line cord you simply attach green and red wires to the green and red (or L1 and L2) indicators in the special add on modular plug you can readily obtain at electronic suppliers or ebay etc. You can use a cord you have bought which already has a modular plug you carefully strip the insulation on the other end, separate out the green and red and cut away black and yellow then you screw them into the L1 and L2 terminals on your network (the transformer looking thing which has a date and 101A on it). Sometimes these are wired for party line service and they won't ring. Simplest way to get the bells to work is to detach the ringer wires, attach one to L1 or L2, put a 1uf capacitor on the other wire and attach the other lead from the capacitor to the remaining L1 or L2. Lastly, if you don't have old fashioned service with real wires on telephone poles you will need an adapter for pulse dialing to work with internet.
Karen
Thanks for all the tips Greg! (however this phone *is* a Northern Electric, not a Western Electric) I can say that with all the confidence of someone holding it and looking at "Northern Electric" stamped into the bakelite. :) ~ karen
Karen
Oh! I would however love to know if you have a trick to quiet the ring a little. WOW it's LOUD. Heart stoppingly loud! ~ karen
Jacob
well the joke is on you because I have the exact same phone with the exact same problem and I was totally able to use your picture to fix mine in 5 minutes. I'm thrilled so take that! And thanks! :-D
Jessica
Please forgive my non-engineer non-mechanical/tech-ness for asking this question... But is there a way to make this be the phone for my mobile device? I move a lot and have given up on landlines (where are digital now anyway), but I have a rotary phone from my grandmother that I've been wanting to fix and use. Thanks!
Karen
I'm afraid not Jessica. ~ karen!
steve nichols
I'm so glad I found this. That change the two wire deal on Youtube was a no-go as you indicated. The one thing I noticed from your pictures was the red wire from the ringer mechanism (double cylinders) was moved from the black block marked "GRND" up to the L1 connection. Once I did that, everything worked. All the other modifications you suggested were spot on. Great work and Thanks!
Mark Florimonte
Awesome post
Fixed my phone and loving it
Thank you
Your pictures and insite was great
Kieron Waterman
Ha ha ha Brilliant!!! If only all women were like you :-) & thank you for the post about printing on wood, Iv been looking all evening for how to do that :-) Now to try this on my great grandmothers old bakelite phone with cotton braided cables. I remember using it as a child and it would be wonderful to hear it ring again.
Thank you
Kieron
Kurt Nickel
I wish Karen would have identified which wire goes where to make the old phone work.
Thank-you
William
Or you could just go to <> and pick up an adaptor. Or hardwire it to the screw terminals inside your wall jack . . . Just saying . . .
Karen
No, actually that isn't possible with this type of phone. For one thing the phone had to be rewired on the inside because someone had changed the wiring to stop the ringing. So picking up an adapter or hardwiring it to the screw terminals isn't always possible. Also, different aged phones have different numbered wires. ~ karen
Aspasia
Okay so I have a, I believe, Bell Atlantic, pay phone. It was updated for modern wiring and works perfectly. My question, have you ever updated any of your phones to wireless? Maybe there is a kit available. Maybe I should contact Verizon as they are the provider of our home service. Maybe you could offer an opinion. THANK YOU for any input. I just stumbled upon your website as I was looking for information.
Greg Field
"You are NOT going to learn how to rewire a vintage phone. You are not.
I know this from experience. But I’m getting a bit ahead of myself as I am want to do when I’m in fits."
Very odd that you would say something like that. You may have found it impossible to digest the wealth of info on the net regarding this, The fact that you may lack the necessary skills to do so has no bearing whatsoever on the usefulness of said info. Have any trouble with your smartphone and go to the tech support page, you find you can't fix your phone, instead of realizing that you are missing something you blame the internet? I restore old phones for a living, I taught myself based on some knowledge of electrical and electronic devices, and have found DOZENS of sources of useful info on wiring all sorts of phones. So it depends on your ability to grasp the technical info, and whether you find a website that speaks to your level of expertise. You are doing people a disservice by discouraging people from trying to learn to do this just because you may not have. Here is the website which I turn to for wiring diagrams http://www.telephonecollectors.info/index.php/browse/wiring-diagrams. So, if you didn't get it to work, either you missed something or you weren't using the correct wiring diagrams. I can probably supply all the diagrams you need, or you can them them from where I did at the link below. There are several versions of the 302 desk phone in your photo, this is mostly a variation on ringer configurations. Wiring green and red to the L1 and L2 connectors on the 101 or 104 network inductor will work if there are no other mitigating factors. It's possible that your phone has already been screwed around with, or possible that there is a mechanical problem with the switchhook or the dial
Tara
Hi, I am rewiring a rotary phone today, in Pembroke, 40 minutes west of Renfrew. It was left behind in the house we just bought. Ready to plug it in, wondering what I do what that black wire other than leave it hanging loose.
Greg Field
Black wire is not used in the system except in special cases, so just clip it or ignore it
Kat
Ha, I just acquired a 1960's old rotary dial phone and was looking on line how to replace the wire for a jack and your blog came up on it and I burst out laughing when I seen the pictures as I just took a photo of mine on my tree stump side table that I scooped off the patio of an old boyfriend after seeing yours sometime back. My son thinks I am nuts for the phone and the stump but I love them both!
Karen
LOL. That's funny! ~ karen
Jeffrey Allen
Thank you for assisting other in keeping these American icons functional and operational. Your persistence aided me in doing the very same. IT RINGS!
Dave
Hey Karen. If you are looking for info/parts or a new old phone check out these guys ... http://www.oldphoneworks.com/ They are in Kingston, On
elizabeth
I wanna hook up an iphone to an old rotary phone too! My sister has an "old-school" room in her house, but doesn't have a land line. It would be awesome if I could get her rotary phone to get calls from her cell/iphone. (And, incidentally, from an i-device to an old radio... I've heard its dangerous)
Rob
You're just like me, I have ADD but can hyper focus, like a missile-lock. I CAN NOT give up, no matter how many hours it takes, and sometimes spending way more money than it is worth.
What model is that phone? The original 'matrix' phone! I love it. Western Electric 301 I believe? Correct me if I'm wrong.
I've always just connected the yellow wire to the green wire (tip). Red wire is (ring). Hearing these terms I didn't know why the yellow wire didn't go to the red (ring... makes more sense), but Tip and Ring are coined from back in the days where an operator would plug a headphone-like jack into your line. The tip of the 1/4" audio-like jack would be the green wire, which is the positive terminal, and the ring would be the lower half, negative. Normally around 45V DC on hook, and when it rings it changes to AC, on my Frontier POTS line I measured 145 VAC at 20Hz.
The problem I face now is trying to hook these bad boys up to my Google Voice line via an OBI 110. I got a cool box from http://www.dialgizmo.com that converts pulse to tone, but the ring is weak. The OBI202 I can jack the voltage to 145 VAC, and it rings loud enough, but the OBI110 it won't ring right even when I set it to 145.
The phone I am working on is the feminine counterpart to the 'matrix' phone, the 'empress' phone (heavy French looking one with brass handle and oval base) for my sister. However, the ringer has only 1 bell, and rings rather weak.
It's a pain in the butt to get apart, has no loudness adjustment, had to mess around with it to get it to work. Has anyone ever swapped capacitors to get it to ring better at lower voltage? Right now it's a 470 nF 250v, and tested fine. I was looking for a gap adjustment, to no avail.
Got it to work fine on my POTS, but on my OBI110, it just doesn't have the juice to get it ringing loud enough. For many this will sound Greek but if anyone knows please reply!
Jack
I have automatic electric lpo8255 payphone. I need
to get it out of my wooden phone booth. I have no key, is it possible to drill out the lock? or will
I cause damage
Charlene
Lousy rough day at work. Thank you for the laugh!!!!
Karen
Hi Charlene - I'm there for ya. ~ karen!
Charlene
PS. I'm as stubborn and for lack of better word, anal. Glad you got the phone working. Knew you would!!!!